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k-289
Senior Advisor

Re: Great Link...not for the bs article, but for the rebuttal posts below it

Be happy its mush limbas birthday today----

schnurrbart
Frequent Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

By all accounts, this guy has had severe problems for many years.  Why didn't he go kill someone sooner?  The reason is that he needed a catalyst and that catalyst most likely was all the hateful speech coming from the politicos with most of the violent speech and innuendo was recently coming mostly from the right.  Both sides are at fault as can be seen on here but if the Dems were to blame on this, why did he kill one and attempt to kill another Dem?  Why didn't he go after Sheriff joe or mccain or kyl?

Democratforlife
Frequent Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

 


@schnurrbart wrote:

By all accounts, this guy has had severe problems for many years.  Why didn't he go kill someone sooner?  The reason is that he needed a catalyst and that catalyst most likely was all the hateful speech coming from the politicos with most of the violent speech and innuendo was recently coming mostly from the right.  Both sides are at fault as can be seen on here but if the Dems were to blame on this, why did he kill one and attempt to kill another Dem?  Why didn't he go after Sheriff joe or mccain or kyl?


He shot and killed a federal judge who was appointed by the 1st Bush President. The kid did not pick and choose who he shot.

 

r3020
Senior Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism


@schnurrbart wrote:

By all accounts, this guy has had severe problems for many years.  Why didn't he go kill someone sooner?  The reason is that he needed a catalyst and that catalyst most likely was all the hateful speech coming from the politicos with most of the violent speech and innuendo was recently coming mostly from the right.  Both sides are at fault as can be seen on here but if the Dems were to blame on this, why did he kill one and attempt to kill another Dem?  Why didn't he go after Sheriff joe or mccain or kyl?


He went after Ms. Giffords because he didn't like the answer she gave to a question he ask back in 07. She had sent him a letter thanking him for attending an event she hosted and he wrote die bitch on the letter. The fact that he kept the letter in his safe shows what kind of a mind he has.

dagwud
Senior Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

Bart, if you are watching and reading the same news accounts that I am then it amazes me how you can keep coming up with the assumption that Loughner acted out because of some politically inspired "catalyst." 

 

He just shot people now because his mental health had just recently gotten much worse if have listened to his friends comments.  I would contend that being recently booted out of college, not being able to find a job and even being dismissed from the volunteer job he had at an animal shelter, being turned down by the military, drifting apart from his friends and not having any luck dating played a much bigger factor in Loughner snapping then his impression or views on politics. 

schnurrbart
Veteran Advisor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

So you think it took him 4 years to do this???  BS!  Also, if his mental state had recently gotten worse, why did he target her?  Why didn't he go to a mall or some place with LOTS of people instead of just a relative few to start taking out his demented thoughts?  You also don't know when he wrote that on the envelope.  As GTO says, we don't know much of anything right now but none of it is going to matter because he has an insanity plea locked and he will be in the same type facility as Hinckley and not the gas chamber.

schnurrbart
Veteran Advisor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

He went there, according to the FBI, to specifically shoot Mrs. Giffords and then take out as many people as he could before the police assisted his suicide.  I haven't seen the magazine he had loaded but if it was a larger capacity that normal it possibly contained 33 rounds as that is the largest mag. that pistol (Glock 19) can handle.  He may not have loaded it fully if he had to reload when he did and he most likely didn't expect anyone would stop him until the police shot him.  The fact that he did shoot a federal judge from AZ means that the trial will probably NOT be in AZ.  His lawyer has already requested that ALL AZ district federal judges recuse themselves.

dagwud
Senior Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

I have seen several of Loughner's friends and acquaintances telling reporters his personality and mental state changed traumatically in just the last year.  I personally am guessing he had some strange kind of fixation with the attractive Rep. Gifford's.  One of his complaints to a friend was his lack of success with dating girls.    I think he was very upset when he tried earlier to impress her with his idiotic question about government and words having any meanings but she seemed to brush of his question as nonsensical and unimportant which it was.   

 

I also wonder what exactly happened at his house earlier that morning when neighbors reported they saw him retrieve a black bag from his car when it appeared his father began arguing with him before Loughner was seen running off in the distance.  I think this kid had several personal and emotional problems that combined with his fragile mental state made him snap.

 

 

r3020
Senior Contributor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

I just hope all the hate the left has spewed about Palin over the last few days doesn't cause some one to try to take her out.

tomtoolbag
Veteran Advisor

Re: Arizona on the brink of extremism

  What's strange is that there are signs that are similar to other perpetrators of incidents like this. I read an article today(Washington Post) that investigators are wondering where he got the money to purchase the guns and ammo. Also it brought up what you referred to dagwud, and said that his father hopped into his truck and chased after him.

  So, he was pulled over for running a stop sign and obviously didn't give any indication of his sobriety or lack of to the officer when the officer spent a little time writing him a warning and letting him go. Then he supposedly went to Wal-Mart and bought ammo and apparently didn't(again) display any signs of weirdness. 

  But, due to him recently being expelled from a community college for his behavior, and also the fact that they wouldn't let him attend without some type of care or counseling. This is where the other incidents and this one cross paths possibly when some type of behavior/mood altering prescribed medication that he was on. Remember, he was refused entry into the military because of his "drug usage", or what he was maybe on that would make him ineligible for entry, or psychiatric types of meds.

  This whole thing has patterns that resemble similar incidents and the behavior/actions of the actor involved. He knew the congresswoman from not only his synagogue but had received a letter previously from her for attending or showing interest in her campaign. I assume that he chose her because of his knowledge(first high profile person to come into his mind)of her and the apparent publicity or attention that his actions would receive. I'm going to say that he was under psychiatric care and the information about his therapist and his medications will be murky, and he will plead guilty by reason of insanity. The whole trial will be odd and murky, if there is one at all(and I doubt there will be) and he'll be sentenced to a psychiatric prison.

 

  Ironically, there's a court case that's been in the limelight again, and it's definitely weird that he mentioned "mind-control", which is what the case is about. Here's the link:

 

http://ritualabuse.us/mindcontrol/mc-documents-links/

 

2010 Court Case – Veterans vs CIA

CIA Tries Again to Duck Responsibility for Doing Drug Experiments on Veterans By MARIA DINZEO December 14, 2010 SAN FRANCISCO (CN) – The Central Intelligence Agency in January will argue for dismissal of Vietnam veterans’ claims that the CIA must provide them with information about the health effects of chemicals used on them during Cold War-era human experiments. The CIA also claims it is not obligated to provide the veterans with medical care for side effects of the drugs. It’s the CIA’s third attempt to get the case dismissed.
In a 2009 federal lawsuit, Vietnam Veterans of America claimed that the Army and CIA had used at least 7,800 soldiers as guinea pigs in “Project Paperclip.” They were given at least 250 and as many as 400 types of drugs, among them sarin, one of the most deadly drugs known to man, amphetamines, barbiturates, mustard gas, phosgene gas and LSD.
Among the project’s goals were to control human behavior, develop drugs that would cause confusion, promote weakness or temporarily cause loss of hearing or vision, create a drug to induce hypnosis and identify drugs that could enhance a person’s ability to withstand torture.
https://www.courthousenews.com/2010/12/14/32562.htm