cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Senior Advisor

Re: Why in the world

Do you compare union benefits to communism. Union Benefits are capitalism in its true sense. Management negotiates with labor for wages plus benefits. Purely capitalistic. The struggle betwen buy and seller is no differnt that you negotiating for a bag of seed corn. You offer, they accept and the negotiation goes on until an agreement is made.

 

Union greed didn't kill anyones pensions. Managements failure to fund it did. They thought they could delay funding until future times when margins improved. In fact they are paying today for what they should have funded years ago. The corps are in default not labor and you want to blame labor for the failures of management. But then you folks want to blame social security for budget shortfalls when you have been borrowing SS funds to finance your budget deficits.

 

I hope you never fail at your business, but if you do don't blame your failure on your hired man. He has his responsibility to do his job for the rate he is offered and as long as he honors that commitment you best look at your own management skills.

 

BY the way. Which liberties have you lost?

Honored Advisor

Re: Why in the world

Don, let me ask you this: back in the 70`s if GM didn`t accept union demands what wouldv` happened?? I`ll answer and you say where I`m wrong. The union would have forced workers to go on strike. If a worker wanted to go back to work or if GM found willing workers union thugs would kick the mother lovin` sh*t out of them. The factory would sit idle and if for too long GM would be in chapter 7. Those union contracts were signed under undue influence and duress, to be honest are only worth wipping your @ss with. In your seed corn example,  I could walk away from the dealer and he wouldn`t break my kneecaps or burn down the Morton shed. I`m really pro labor, it`s just what good did those pensions do?? No workers in the future will get them. Whooppy-do for you if you were in the UAW between 1970 and 1999.....after that SOL dude.

Senior Contributor

Re: Don't You think those employees

Thanks, Don. I was hoping you would get around to the real truth about those pesky pensions! BA, is going on like it was a gift from the companies, IT WASN'T, THE PEOPLE PAYED FOR THEM!! Don, is right as rain, it was the company greed that spent the pension money. You people keep defending the corporations, their hot shot CEO's are what's wrong with America, not the people working on the line that made them rich.

Honored Advisor

Re: Don't You think those employees

Hey Greatone, que pasa!  The only way I know of that auto workers could keep getting those benefits is if a tariff was slapped on each imported auto coming in the ports. There`s just no way US car companies could compete with that handicap in a free trade environment. I do agree the salaries and bonuses for head honchos is out of hand, $20 million in some cases...gimme a fricken break. 

Advisor

Re: Why in the world

I'm in agreement that they probably won't get those pensions, but not becasue of any contracts they signed. They'll just go up in flames like everybody else's savings are likely to, thanks to GS, Congressmenand women of both parties owned by the banks and other forces of crony captialism and all of the rest of the thin air money gang.

Honored Advisor

Re: Why in the world

Hey Bruce, folks used to have one job their whole life . They gave their pound of flesh for financial security. Today like it or not everyone`s a free agent. The pensioners of old will die out through attrition. 

Senior Contributor

Re: tariff on auto's

BA; a tariff on imported auto's might bite you.

Think you might be surprised just where all the different vehicals are made.

In today's world they make them in one place and ship them around the world bringing other models back from where they are made.

Tariff sounds great but I do not think it helps anyone in the long run it is just another way to say subsidy. Like the tariff on ethanol coming into your country. I believe it is somewhere around .52 cents?? but is really just another subsidy for your corn added to the subsidy that is paid to use ethanol.

Free markets seldom exist except in some peoples minds and adding tariff's is another way to end them.

Honored Advisor

Re: tariff on auto's

Well Canuck, I didn`t say it was a perfect solution for car companies to afford pensions Smiley Very Happy. Don and GTO seem to think these companies have a printing press out back and can just handout money whenever unions demand it. When each car coming off the assembly line has to add the cost of 2 or 3 retirees......I don`t know how that could be sustainable. I will say this about the free trade kool-aid we`ve all decided to drink. Look at the standard of living of those you`re trading with, more than likely your standard go down to theirs rather than vicey-versa.

Senior Contributor

Re: tariff on auto's


@BA Deere wrote:

, more than likely your standard go down to theirs rather than vicey-versa.


That has been a concern in Canada, that we would end up with health care like yoursSmiley Very Happy Smiley Very Happy

Senior Advisor

Re: tariff on auto's

No.  I simply believe they ought to honor contracts that management signs. It's quite comparable to farmers signing a high cash rent lease and then complaining that the rates are too high. 

 

Two or three retirees earned those benefits while they were actively employed. Why do you think they should be stiffed at this late date?