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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!


@GoredHusker wrote:

I guess you're right.  We should try to adopt failed policies of the past and continue to beat our heads against a brick wall with regards to guns.  Let's go ahead and ban them like we did with alcohol.  Let's make them illegal just like we are drugs and see if we can be any more successfull with the war on guns than we are the war on drugs.  Let me get this straight, we're going to start a new war because we've bun so successful with our war on drugs and our war on illegal aliens.  We'll just call Helicopter Ben and get him to warm up the printing presses further because the war on guns probably won't be any cheaper than the war on drugs.


With so many guns already in your country you will never 'ban them' and be rid of them.

 

There are lots of reason to control them and reduce the idea that a gun is going to save everyone from gun toting people.

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Veteran Advisor

Re: More stats

I am not trying to prove stastictics, so much as I am trying to make a point.  If the mere presence of guns, and their availability to people, is the cause of the gun violence, places like Kennesaw, should have blood running in the streets, on a daily basis.  Instead, it is the only town of its size I can think of in the US, that has gone decades without any kind of gunshot death.  I am trying to make the point, that it is the killers, that kill, and not the presense of the guns.  Someone who is bound to kill someone else, will naturally use the tool that makes the job easiest, hence the use of the gun, just as someone who needs to tighten pipes, will most likely use a pipe wrench as the best tool to do the job, as opposed to something else.

 

The murder by illegal aliens, is to counter the point that it is all the fault of the USA gun cultuer.  I was trying to ask, how the culture of the US can be blamed for all the killings, when murders by illegal aliens, in some areas, make up 90% of the warrants out for homocide?  How can you blame US culture, for something done, by someone not of the US, and not here legally?  I guess one could say that the culture of letting violent people roam the streets, could be to blame, but if you were to poll gun owners on their opinions of that, you would find out, it goes against their beliefs, far more than it goes with them.  Instead, it is the crimial element, that will commit crimes regardless of the law, and who use a gun as their tool, that are giving the guns a bad name.

 

I can use my neighborhood as an example.  I can think of no household, in this area, that does not have at least one gun in it somewhere, and most have more than one.  Yet, in the last 30+ years, we have had exactly ONE homocide, and one attempted homocide, in the entire county, and both were stabbings.  If you want to go back to the homocide before that (I only know of two by memory), you'd have to go back something like 50 or 60 years, and that was a strangulation (after a rape, when the girl started screaming), unless you count the perpetrator of the strangulation, who was shot by deputies, after escaping from jail.  I don't belive the presense of guns, had anything to do, with either murder.

If restricting gun ownership is the answer, why was Washington, D.C. called the 'murder capital' of the entire USA, at the time when they had just about the strongest gun laws in the entire nation?   Shouldn't it have been the other way around?
Some may say it is the guns, but I say it is the culture, and the criminal element.   When culture degrades to the point, that violent acts occur, and in some cases even excused or tolerated, you are going to get more violent acts.  I belive it is that simple.  The complicated part, is now that there are areas where it has degraded to that point, how do we make it better?

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

In the county where I live, I know of only two murders.  In neither case, was a gun used.  One was a stabbing, one was strangulation.

 

Banning guns, does not seem to work.  It is a nice theory, but does not seem to work, in practice.  Here is an article, that I tend to agree with, with links to all the stats, in case you want to look them up.  I boldened the part, that comes closest to paralelling my beliefs.

 

http://www.learnaboutguns.com/2009/03/27/stabbing-of-children-up-72-in-england-over-the-last-decade/

 

As reported, the number of children in the UK hospitalized with knife attack wounds is up 72% compared to 10 years ago (around when that country’s strict gun control laws were enacted).  In other words, not only did gun related crime rise after the gun ban, but so did knife related crime:

As I’ve previously discussed, Britain enacted a series of laws that bars most gun ownership, and and restricts the carrying of knives.  British citizens who shoot criminals that break into their homes have been convicted of murder, and then denied parole because they showed no remorse for defending themselves, and would “continue to pose a danger to any other burglars.“  Not surprisingly, criminals increasingly ignore the gun control laws and continue to commit their crimes against the now-defenseless victims.

The increase in the use of knives by criminals should not come as a surprise either.  Britain’s problem is not the presence of gun, or the presence of knives, but instead the presence of criminals.  The only way that the crime problem will be solved is to take steps to prevent children from growing up to be criminals, and to take the existing criminals off the street.  The current approach of increasingly restrictive gun laws, which prevent even the British Olympic pistol team from practicing in their own country, are not working.

Focusing on inanimate objects, rather than the intentional actions of criminals, will not address the problem of crime.  It is time for politicians on both sides of the Atlantic Ocean to realize this, and stop trying to ban guns, which are the most effective self defense tool yet invented by humanity.

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

Why don't we focus on the criminals?
I posted links to the stats, about half the murders in the US, are by people with prior convictions, if I remember right, over 40% were felons.  Take care of them, and murders drop by half, or more.

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

I work with hunter safety education, and the stats show, that as we educate more people about safe gun handling, the accident rate, goes down.  According to the guy in charge, he said that accidental injury or death by firearms is at or near the lowest rate ever.

 

One instructor compared it to electricity.  If you took some people who knew nothing about electricity, and gave them a frayed extension cord, and let them try to figure the danger out for themself, would they not be far more likely to hurt themselves, or someone else, than someone properly educated in its safety?

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

Some stats put that higher:  http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_percentage_of_Americans_own_guns

 

At the end of 2010 it was estimated that 45% of Americans own guns. If you took the percentage of guns to the number of Americans, the number rises to 90%.  - snip -

 

However, many gun owners support Obama, with the idea that any gun controls he may or may not sign onto, will either not affect them, or the benefits of voting for him, will outweigh any negatives of gun restrictions.  Gun owners are not  the homogonous group, that all fall into lockstep, that many portray them to be.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

I believe you will find most U.S. citizens do not have the idea that a gun is going to save them.  Most of my friends that have a concealed weapon so that they can throw a gun either under the seat or behind the seat of their pickup to shoot varmits.  It isn't with the idea that it will save them from a gun toting thug. 

 

It's been a while since I last purchased a gun, but my understanding is there is gun control.  In Nebraska, we have to have a permit obtained from the sheriff's office in order to purchase a handgun. 

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

You need the permit to get any firearm, if you want to walk out the door with it, in Nebraska. The handgun certificate is also used for the instant background check.
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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

You are right.  Hand them out on street corners for all the kids to have.  Make them a compulsory acquirement when you by a big mac. Mandate them at birth and at first day of school.  You just don't get it do you?

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

I need no more proof than the fact when Australia handed in their guns there has not been anything like a massacre, which incidentally, happens with monotonous regularity in your country. All your questions about debating and justification for this and that is bullsh-t.  You do not have the foresight to see all the US can be excused of the stupidity of having the country awash with guns.  Oh no  -  you have that blessed 2nd amend. And then there is the testosterone thing as well. We need them to defeat the government - what bullsh-t. Personal protection - another lie.  Yeah sure - you are so brainwashed into thinking you need them, it is now hereditary.