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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

 Toews called the long-gun registry a "failed boondoggle."

"There is no evidence that it has stopped a single crime or saved a single life."

 

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2011/11/15/ending-gun-registry-firearms-trafficking-memo-ottawa_n_10942...

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

It was the fault of someone not checking to be sure the gun was unloaded.  Just because something 'bad' happens, does not mean it it always something's fault.

 

My next door neighbor died in the cattle water tank, just a couple months ago.


Was it the fault of water, or the tank?

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

I am not arguing for 'more' guns, in the sense that you are implying.  You guys are putting those words in my mouth.  What I am arguing, is that restricting gun ownership, does not reduce crime in this country.

 

I am arguing, that NO WHERE, in the United States, has stricter gun laws, ever lowered crime.  To reduce crime, you need to reduce criminals, and criminal behavior.  There are, however, plenty of instances, where LAW ABIDING citizens, had restrictions eased, so that they could LEGALLY own, and LEGALLY carry firearms, and then the crime rate went down.

You are both arguing theory, of what would work in this country, which has not been followed by any actual evidence that I am aware of.


If there were a rash of break-ins, would you be blaming crowbars?

Would 'eliminating access to crowbars' put an end to the problem?

 

Or, is it a symptom, of a bigger problem.

 

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

It was the fault of someone not checking to be sure the gun was unloaded.  Just because something 'bad' happens, does not mean it it always something's fault.

 

My next door neighbor died in the cattle water tank, just a couple months ago.


Was it the fault of water, or the tank?


May have been a fault in safety procedures BUT if there is no purpose to have a gun why take the risk of keeping one.

 

And before you start with the 'protection from bad guys' argument how many people have ever or will ever use their gun to protect themselves?

The % is probably very low while the risk of having the gun is high.

Even suicide rates are higher in homes with guns and the success rate is higher with guns.

 

There is a cost to having a gun in a home.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

I do not think gun control will work in your country (and it has to be country wide to be successful at any time) because of the attitude ingrained in your culture thaat guns are the answer to all problems.

 

there is no way one jurisdiction can control guns when neighbouring jurisdictions have no contols.

Look at how many guns are smuggled across the international border into Canada from the USA and you can see how there can be no control across a city boundary or even a state border.

 

Crowbars are the tool and few guns are able to break down a door BUT a gun will kill many more people quicker and easier than a crowbar will.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!


@Taylor ECIL wrote:

 Toews called the long-gun registry a "failed boondoggle."

"There is no evidence that it has stopped a single crime or saved a single life."

 

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2011/11/15/ending-gun-registry-firearms-trafficking-memo-ottawa_n_10942...


And without the registry the police can no longer check to see if there is a registered gun in a household.

Courts can no longer check to see if a person has a registered gun when they prohibit them from having firearms.

So everyone is assumed to have a gun until they prove otherwise.

 

All this lack of security but nothing else is changed, you still have to have a license to buy or trade a gun and to purchase ammunition for the gun that you are licensed to have.

 

BTW they also wasted all the money that wqs spent to set up the registry when they destroyed the data that had been collected. That was the waste of our $$.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

Only honest people put their guns on the gun registry. The ones who are truly not afaid of going to jail won't have it on the list. Your registry hurts the lawabiding, not the criminals. But lawful ones are the ones you want to punish.

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Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!


@Canuck_2 wrote:

@Nebrfarmr wrote:

It was the fault of someone not checking to be sure the gun was unloaded.  Just because something 'bad' happens, does not mean it it always something's fault.

 

My next door neighbor died in the cattle water tank, just a couple months ago.


Was it the fault of water, or the tank?


May have been a fault in safety procedures BUT if there is no purpose to have a gun why take the risk of keeping one.

 

Do you have anything, in your house, that others can decide for you, if they have no purpose, and should stay?  If people know the risks, and are willing to take them, why is it someone else's business? 

 

Also, your 'may have been a fault in safety procedures' is a gross understatement.  The #1 rule is to ALWAYS treat a gun as if it is loaded, and to NEVER point it at anything you aren't willing to have a bullet go flying at.  I think that a simple safety course should be necessary to be a gun owner, but because someone is recless with an item, does not mean the item is at fault.  Chances are, the gun did exactly what it was supposed to do.

 

If the guy was fixing his toaster, without unplugging it first, and got shocked, would you be fore removing electricity from his house?

 

 

Where is your data, to illustrate a higher suicide rate for gun owners?  I did a quick search, and found this:

 

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvintl.html

 

"Gun death" statistics are frequently cited, in the manner above, to strongly
suggest that guns are the cause behind the high violent death rate in the U.S.
As in the case of the Los Angeles Times article, no mention is made that over
half of those violent deaths are suicides. The CNN article mentions gun
homicides and gun suicides, but fails to show us the total violent death
rate of other countries, not just gun deaths. For example, in Japan, where gun
ownership is rare, its total suicide rate is higher than our total suicide rate.

I willl concede, though that the percentage of successful suicides, goes up with firearm availability, if you read those stats.  However the data I find that shows gun owners have increased rates of suicide attempts, is suggestive, at best.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

A toaster has a usefull purpose almost everyday and is quite safe unless someone really tries to overcome the safties on it.

 

A gun, other than for rodents control or possibly hunting, has little to no use and dose contribute to making a home less safe.

 

Researchers from the Harvard School of Public Health examined nationwide statistics on suicide rates and gun ownership. They found that in the 15 states with the highest numbers of household gun owners, the suicide rate was double that of the 6 states with the lowest numbers of household gun owners. Population sizes among the states were similar.

The study authors stated that while only 5 percent of all suicide attempts involve guns, over 90 percent of all suicide attempts involving guns are fatal. By contrast, 75 percent of suicide attempts involve drug overdoses, but only 3 percent of these are fatal.

"Removing all firearms from one's home is one of the most effective and straightforward steps that household decision-makers can take to reduce the risk of suicide," Matthew Miller, assistant professor of health policy and management, said in a prepared statement. Miller led the research team.

http://voices.yahoo.com/suicide-rates-significantly-higher-states-with-297271.html?cat=72

 

First link on the search I did.

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Senior Contributor

Re: Need more guns!!

A toaster has a usefull purpose almost everyday and is quite safe unless someone really tries to overcome the safties on it.

 

You haven't been around to many guns have you? All guns I have are quite safe unless you really try to overcome the safties on them.