cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Senior Contributor

Re: My first link


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

I keep my guns, locked in a gun cabinet. 

There is NO reason, to not have your guns stored in a safe manner.  Even if you are destitute, you can get trigger locks, for free, from the Sheriff, for any and all guns you own.

To blame a gun, because of careless storage on the part of an idiotic owner, goes back to blaming the toaster for shocking you, because it had a frayed cord, or whatever.

One thing, I must ask about your source, one that I found when I was looking up links, is the length of time, the gun was owned.  I can't find the link right now, but if you take away the guns bought more than a month before the suicde, (if I remember right) a home with locked guns, is as safe as one without.  They speculate, that those people were contemplating suicide, and bought the gun for it (but have no concrete proof, because you can't ask the deceased too many questions).

 


Maybe we see it differently but I would think if a person was wanting to commit suicide a locked gun would not stop them.

A home with no guns would make them choose a different method and stats show other methods are not as fatal as a gun even if they are able to complete the task since other methods slow down the process and allow some to change their minds.

Picking up a gun and pulling the trigger does not take long or leave much time to reconsider the impulse.

Veteran Advisor

Re: My first link

Your own link, pointed out that homes with locked guns, had a lower incidence, than those with unlocked guns, so even if small, there must be some correlation to it.  If nothing else, it would keep a depressed, drunk, or high on drugs person from grabbing a gun, and pulling the trigger.

Also, are there any other underlying factors?  Such as why the households in that area are more 'armed' than others?  Do they live in an area with high crime, drugs, etc?

I remember in school, I had a stats teacher, overlay two graphs that followed each other almost perfectly.  One was the incidents of rape (per capita) and the other, was ice cream sales.  He commented, that stastically, either ice cream sales could be proven to cause rapes, or rapes could be proven to cause more ice cream sales, but if you stepped back, and looked at the big picture, most rapes occured during the warmer months, where a predator was more likely to be able to lie in wait without getting frostbite, and snatch a victim.  Also, it may be 'easier' to commit the crime, without all the bulky clothing, and thirdly, under bulky clothing, it is hard to tell if your intended victim is armed in some way. 

I guess what I am trying to say, is while I don't argue your numbers, I can't seem to get my head around, the correlation, because, like you, I would think that someone detrmined to kill themselves, would find a way to do it (I know a girl who cut her wrists, for example).  However, I guess using a gun, makes a successful outcome more likely.

Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

Things like this, make me wish I wan't colorblind, LOL. 

What I can see, is that it seems in the Northern part of the Western Hemisphere, that the pattern is, the farther North you go, the less incidents of violence, and as you go South to the Equator, the violence rate goes up.  South America, trends similarly, in that as you work your way to the South Pole, the rate goes down.

Maybe location, has something to do with it, as well?

Senior Contributor

Re: My first link


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

Your own link, pointed out that homes with locked guns, had a lower incidence, than those with unlocked guns, so even if small, there must be some correlation to it.  If nothing else, it would keep a depressed, drunk, or high on drugs person from grabbing a gun, and pulling the trigger.

Also, are there any other underlying factors?  Such as why the households in that area are more 'armed' than others?  Do they live in an area with high crime, drugs, etc?

I remember in school, I had a stats teacher, overlay two graphs that followed each other almost perfectly.  One was the incidents of rape (per capita) and the other, was ice cream sales.  He commented, that stastically, either ice cream sales could be proven to cause rapes, or rapes could be proven to cause more ice cream sales, but if you stepped back, and looked at the big picture, most rapes occured during the warmer months, where a predator was more likely to be able to lie in wait without getting frostbite, and snatch a victim.  Also, it may be 'easier' to commit the crime, without all the bulky clothing, and thirdly, under bulky clothing, it is hard to tell if your intended victim is armed in some way. 

I guess what I am trying to say, is while I don't argue your numbers, I can't seem to get my head around, the correlation, because, like you, I would think that someone detrmined to kill themselves, would find a way to do it (I know a girl who cut her wrists, for example).  However, I guess using a gun, makes a successful outcome more likely.


I can think of some reasons why homes with guns are more dangerous and first it is probably because many gun owners are already a little unstable since they are so paranoid they think they have to be armed to protect themselves from...... well everything it seems from rapists to burglars to those street gangs in the city and the list goes on.

 

Yes I know some have a gun to shoot nuisance animals like I do but look at the reasons most often given on this site for having a gun.

Veteran Advisor

Re: Need more guns!!

A felony is a serious violent or property crime that has the potential for sending a person to a state prison for one year or more and includes murder, rape, robbery, assault, burglary, larceny, vehicle theft, drug trafficking or weapons offense (our definition).

A misdemeanor is a lesser crime that carries a possible sentence of less than one year in a county or city jail (our definition).

Using a beer bottle to hurt someone is a felony. Threatening someone with a beer bottle in your hand is a misdemeanor.

Please note that the majority of crime in America is not reported and the majority of reported crime does not result in an arrest and in many jurisdictions, a significant minority of crimes are not prosecuted. Thus if you reach the stage where the criminal justice system is prosecuting you for a felony, either you have done something very wrong or the system is tired of seeing you back in court.

77 percent of felony defendants have at least one prior arrest and 69 percent have multiple prior arrests. 61 percent have at least one conviction and 49 percent have multiple convictions.

35 percent of those charged with felonies have 10 or more prior arrests and another 17 percent have between 5 to 9 arrests, thus 52 percent of charged felons have been arrested and before the courts many times.

 

http://crimeinamerica.net/2010/06/02/repeat-felons-dominate-the-criminal-justice-system%E2%80%94most...

 

 

When 27 percent of violent felons, have 5 or more prior arrests, we have a problem.  They were caught, but let loose, to do more harm.   I can see giving someone a 2nd chance, or even a 3rd chance, but a 9th and 10th chance??

49% of violent felons had multiple convictions, not arrests, but convictions. 
I wonder, what kind of numbers, a more peaceful place, like Canada has.  Do they have people roaming the streets, with multiple convictions, or do they do something about it, after the 2nd one?

Veteran Advisor

Re: My first link

If they live in an area, where crime runs rampant, are they truly paranoid?

Senior Advisor

Re: My first link


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

If they live in an area, where crime runs rampant, are they truly paranoid?


I looked but couldn't find much. I would like to know how long term welfare benefits flowing into a community affects violent crime rates.

Senior Contributor

Re: My first link


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

If they live in an area, where crime runs rampant, are they truly paranoid?


The point is another gun is not going to solve a crime problem.

Guns just make crime problems more deadly.

 

 

Veteran Advisor

Re: My first link

And taking one away from a law abiding person, will do zero, to cut crime.

Senior Contributor

Re: My first link


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

And taking one away from a law abiding person, will do zero, to cut crime.


But if that 'law abiding person' has no need of it then why do they have it?

It does present a hazard in the home and even an attraction to a criminal to steal it.