Wave that Ketchsup stained shirt

[NewAgJudge]

[Canuck_2]

I did not say the US was bad and i know Canada got dragged into that illegal war too.

What I was saying is there was no legitimate reason for foreign armies to invade Afghanistan.

No Afghanistan was not invloved in the terrorist attacks om New York.

The reason that war was started was pure retribution which was taken out on thousands of innocent people.

It was unnecessary, it was not good policy and it has led to a lot of bloodshed that is on the hands of those who started it.

I know it is hard for someone who was involved in it and probably lost some friends or at least wasted a year or so of your life to admit how wrong it was but try looking at it objectively and consider what led to it, what was gsined and what has been lost and is still being paid for in blood.

Yes the US built schools and so did Canada but we were forcing our ways on them and killing their family members doing it and then you act surprised that they resisted and fought back.

No legal or even moral reason for any of that war and it has cost hundreds of thousands of lives now and the killing continues with latest news that El Quada forces are about to take control of a large town. More killing and bloodshed which still has to be blamed on those who wanted retribution for a measly 3,000 lives and then they took it out on people who were not involved.

Afghanistan was not our enemy until we attacked them.

Afghanistan was not going to cause us harm until we attacked them.

Remember who were the perpetrators of the plane hijackings Saudi Arabian citizens!

And the powerful US forces were unleashed against Afghanistan a very backward nation unable to defend itself since it was at war with itself.

Retribution against innocents who were unable to protect themselves.

Ask yourself why your leaders wanted retribution instead of justice.

Retribution will never solve our problems.

Your country had the opportunity to turn our world around by seeking justice but unfortunately you had a leader who could not see beyond his religiuos beliefs in retribution and way too many of your fellow citizens followed his leadership.

Something you should really consider and think hard about when you are choosing your leaders, are they really fit to lead your country into the future in a peaceful way or just into more hate, wars and killing in retribution.

[Blacksandfarmer]

News to Canuck, we did not fight Afghanistan, we fought Taliban and al Qaeda forces that were based in Afghanistan. When terrorist murder a "measly 3,000 lives" in Canada I wonder what you will be saying then?

[Canuck_2]

i would say go after the terrorists not a country that was not involved.

Check out what was going on back then when  a little diplomacy could have netted the assumed ring leader of the terrorist attacks.

That instead of attacking a country to kill thousands if innocents in a fruitless hunt for that leader and then claim you were only fighting Taliban and al Qaeda.

Forces that were connected to the terrorist attacks by the flimsiest thread.

I know it is hard to accept that all that killing could have been prevented if only retribution had been rejected, a little diplomacy used and a real leader  was in charge of your country but wise people can see how it all could have been so much better if only...............

[r3020]

+1

[Blacksandfarmer]

Ok, if a terrorist group within the U.S attacked a city in Canada resulting in a large loss of life it would be up to either U.S law enforcement or the U.S military to kill or capture those responsible for that attack. Afghanistan didn't have a government, law enforcement, or a military to deal with al Qaeda. The country was run by the Taliban which supported al Qaeda. After a decade of war the government of Afghanistan really only existed in Kabul. So, who would you have dealt with to find the al Qaeda leaders? I served a 9 month tour in Afghanistan. In that 9 months I saw enough to have a much better handle on these things than you. Contrary to what you may believe, I don't like war. Sometimes wars need to be fought. In our case the war was run really poorly from the top. We did our best to minimize civilian casualties. It's tough when an enemy is basically a ghost within the populace. Say what you want, but terrorist attacks across the world happened far less when we took the fight to the enemy. We were not at war with the Afghan people; we were at war with the enemy of humanity.

[Canuck_2]

Agreed it is up to the country to turn over person wanted by another country BUT the country asking has to provide enough evidence to show the person is likely guilty FIRST.

Now go back to Afghanistan and look at what actually happened.

the US asked for Bin Ladin and Afghanistan governing force came very close to sending him to the US within 1 oe 2 votes in their Shira? spelling?

Now that did not have to be the end of it as many countries take years to process everything before they turn a person over to another country and they also have to make sure that the person will be treated correctly after they were turned over.

you may or may not be aware that there are people in Canada that have been kept here until your country agreed that they would not be subject to the death penalty which took many years to get everything sorted out since we do not have the death penalty so could not extradite them to allow your country to kill them.

BUT it goes much deeper than that when you took the war machine into Afghanistan and then into Iraq you did exactly what the terrorists wanted.

That action created many soldiers for their attempts to take power in those muslim dominated countries.

When the foreign war machine rolled in and killed thousands of innocents in those countries it was the best recruiting that the terrorists could have hoped for.

Why do you think they crossed oceans to kill a few innocents on US soil if not to gain something from it?

What they wanted was your countries help in recruiting more followers of their way of death and destruction.

When our countries invaded theirs on a faulty pretext the terrorists got waht they wanted from the attacks on New York.

Their best ally was people in your country that wanted retribution and did not care who died to pay for the few deaths in New York.

Your country had the sympathy of the world paid for by those 3,000 or so who died and you threw it away and wasted their deaths.

You lacked a leader who could lead you and the world into peace and so we still have war, death and destruction.

It could have been different and hopefully you, the voter, will not make a similar mistake again.

[Canuck_2]

I know you and many others tried your best but just think if you had not even been there or if all the foreign invaders had tried their best.

Good Canadian soldiers died there too, some at the hands of your airforce and your command whitewashed waht was by all indications a bad mistake by a pilot who disobeyed a command not to fire.

There was also the story told by Canadian soldiers on the ground that  spotted suspicious activity and their orders were to kill the suspects.

This was happening in the dark and they watched the suspicious activity with night goggles and chose to pin the suspects down with a little gunfire rather than kill them as their US commanders had told them.

When the sun came up they were able to approach the individuals and determine they were farmers trying to plant some crops in the dark because of the hostilities around them.

Contary to the wishes of the commander those farmers got to live another day.