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Nebrfarmr
Veteran Advisor

Re: amen and

For reading the eitire thread, I do not know if to congratulate you, or send you a sympathy card, LOL

WCMO
Senior Advisor

Re: amen and

It's been a long time since I was "educated" on either the biblical or scientific sides of these issues. 

 

To the people of the Old and New Testaments, the entire world was the world they knew.  This was a very small portion of our planet.  Some/many of the "stories" of the Old Testament probably pre-date human ability to read/write and were summarized later from stories told by generations of elders who used the stories to teach their young where we came from, why we are here, and how we should live.  Some things don't really change.  Documented New Testament writings/teachings were controlled by the people that wrote them, the early religious organizations, powerful rulers in the area, etc., with many influences caused by the desire not to be enslaved, the desire of powerful rulers to control those people, the power/influence of providing hope to people in difficult situations, etc. 

 

http://www.biblewalks.com/

 

There are and have been many religions, with many similarities and differences.  Some people are defined by the region from which they came, some by the color of their skin, some by the religion they have been taught, and some by part/all of these.  How are we to say who is "right" and who is "wrong" -- it is more important to say what is "right" and what is "wrong".  And sometimes it really just doesn't matter.

 

On the science side, I do recall in the 1960's that we were taught in grade school that man evolved from "apes" -- this is probably a direct linkage for some people I've known, lol -- we all know people like that.  Later, I think the theory was revised based on DNA evidence, that the chimpanzee is most closely related to man, sharing a very high percentage of DNA.  Then, the scientific "family tree" showed that humans and chimpanzees most likely shared a common ancestor, with other great "apes" perhaps sharing another common ancestor farther back with that common ancestor, thus making the other great "apes" distantly related, though not in a direct evolutionary line to man.  The common ancestor (for man and chimpanzee) would be so far back in time that it would be miraculous to find identifiable remains with testable DNA, yet I'm sure somebody is looking for it.  There are probably more "human" types of species that have long since become extinct that we haven't discovered, and perhaps never will discover, since a couple of related "human" species have actually been discovered in the past several decades.  One was those "hobbit"-type humans they're still studying, and I think there was another one discovered sometime before that one, plus the Neanderthals, etc.  They've also been able to use DNA to show probable inter-breeding between/among newer and older related species, along with multiple migrations (as opposed to just one big "out of Africa" theory).

 

http://www.daniellaberge.com/grooming/primatesapes1.htm

 

http://www.theage.com.au/news/world/meet-your-ancestor/2006/05/17/1147545394809.html

 

http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/339172/description/Geneticists_go_ape_for_better_primate_...

 

It's kind of like being taught in grade school (1960's and earlier) that Columbus discovered America.  We believed it because that was what we were taught to believe.  However, since Columbus met "native" humans in America, he therefore could not have "discovered" America (other than in his own mind, and for those he served).  Then, we learned that the Vikings had been here before Columbus, and perhaps even ventured beyond the shores of the Atlantic, Great Lakes and Carribean all the way into central USA and beyond.   Seems like I read somewhere that a Viking burial place was discovered somewhere in Arkansas/Oklahoma some time back (though that might be an old hoax made to fool people in the 1800's). And, the South American "native" societies quite likely ventured North, perhaps all the way into central USA and beyond, and etc.  More "evidence" is being discovered all the time.  Columbus did not "discover" America, though from the Euro-Christian viewpoint, he may have.  And, I seriously doubt that the "Garden of Eden" was in Missouri.

 

http://www.utlm.org/onlineresources/gardenofeden.htm

 

Faith is not necessarily the truth, and truth does not necessarily require faith.  We don't have all the answers for the absolute truth, and perhaps never will, so there will always be room for a little faith.

 

 

 

 

gough whitlam
Senior Contributor

Re: Ok

Krafty has got it right.  If you are now feeling a little stupid about donating to those bloodsucking clergy - don't.  They are give there hard earned thinking it will buy them a ticket to heaven. 

 

What Kafty was pointing out was the hypocracy which exists in the catholic church.  He is right to point out the billions in art work which is nothing more than taking up space on walls.  cash in all the massive real estate and art and casinos they have, then donate all of that to the poor and hungry and you  are talking about a real benevolent society.

 

But maybe that is a little far away for the godbotherers who live comfortably in their own little world of make believe.  Like yourself huh! 

gough whitlam
Senior Contributor

Re: Neb and farm4


@FARM4EVER wrote:

thanks for the vast research.  it really wasn't enough for me.  i have faith (confidence in one's abilities with no religious linkage)  that you and i will both keep our beliefs and agree to disagree. all the best to you

 

In a thread above you told Neb you have faith in god and in this one you deny it.  You are all over the shop like a Chinese acrobat with diarrhea.  Either you believe or you don't.  Tell us the truth and we will come at you from another angle.  This should be good.

 

www.farm4ever.com

 

64073652_scaled_342x232.jpg


 

Canuck_2
Senior Contributor

Re: Ok


@gough whitlam wrote:

Krafty has got it right.  If you are now feeling a little stupid about donating to those bloodsucking clergy - don't.  They are give there hard earned thinking it will buy them a ticket to heaven. 

 

What Kafty was pointing out was the hypocracy which exists in the catholic church.  He is right to point out the billions in art work which is nothing more than taking up space on walls.  cash in all the massive real estate and art and casinos they have, then donate all of that to the poor and hungry and you  are talking about a real benevolent society.

 

But maybe that is a little far away for the godbotherers who live comfortably in their own little world of make believe.  Like yourself huh! 


Colin; you did not mention the lates purchase by the Vatican in Rome and home to one of the Cardinals in a 12 room suite right next door to the largest GAY bath house in Europe.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/as-cardinals-gather-to-elect-pope-catholic-officials-...

 

A day ahead of the papal conclave, faces at the scandal-struck Vatican were even redder than usual after it emerged that the Holy See had purchased a €23 million (£21 million) share of a Rome apartment block that houses Europe’s biggest gay sauna.

The senior Vatican figure sweating the most due to the unlikely proximity of the gay Europa Multiclub is probably Cardinal Ivan Dias, the head of the Congregation for Evangelisation of Peoples, who is due to participate in tomorrow’s election at the Sistine Chapel.

 

Canuck_2
Senior Contributor

WCMO

You definitely deserve several 'kudos' for that.

Well thought out and well written.

 

So true about what we were taught about Columbus etc. (only I was taught before the 1960ies) and then what science and new discoveries have shown since.

And it should be noted even Columbus had some evidence that others had alread sailed west nad found land. It was not totally his idea.

 

Thanks.

gough whitlam
Senior Contributor

Re: Ok

Christ Bill.   Tell me it isn't so?   Nothing like a little bit of slap and tickle while having a little gay jaunt at the local warm wallow while selecting another pope - keeping up the traditions I think it is called. . What a pius sanctamonous lot of squalid opportunists.

 

See who has the guts to reply to your thread.

Nebrfarmr
Veteran Advisor

Re: Ok

1) I will admit that there are some Churches that tend to keep back a little more for themselves than I would like.   I don't give to those.

 

2)  What do you have against the gays?   You make it sound like owning property next to them is some kind of pox or something, what's with that?

 

3)  I read a lot of words, and noticed insults and innuendo, but no list of any orginaziation that has done more to help the truly hungry/needy, than Christian charities.

Canuck_2
Senior Contributor

Re: Ok


@Nebrfarmr wrote:

1) I will admit that there are some Churches that tend to keep back a little more for themselves than I would like.   I don't give to those.

 

2)  What do you have against the gays?   You make it sound like owning property next to them is some kind of pox or something, what's with that?

 

3)  I read a lot of words, and noticed insults and innuendo, but no list of any orginaziation that has done more to help the truly hungry/needy, than Christian charities.


I have no problem with gays.

It is a natural thing that does not make any difference to me.

 

It does appear to be an unusal happening for an organization that considers homosexuality a sin to buy a building with the largest gay bath house in Europe in it and set up a Cardinal in a 12 room suite beside it.

Nebrfarmr
Veteran Advisor

Re: Ok

I am not Catholic, so I will not pretend to speak for the Catholics, but my church does what it can, to help anyone.   Jesus preached to the prostitutes and criminals, and never 'avioded' them, but rather took opportunities to help them.

Maybe that is one angle.

Or, maybe they got the property cheap, LOL.