cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
sdholloway56
Senior Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

A lot of farms keep the help busy off season hauling grain and I think most advisors will tell you to set up a separate corp. for the trucking on account of the huge potential liability.

On the question of an estate tax, if the estate is just a pile of stocks and bonds or passive property, no big deal- heirs would just have to sell some to cover tax liability and there's no economic impact.

The problem is with large, privately held firms. Again, if there is no material participation from the heirs and it has value then life will go on. The hard part is how to approach family owned businesses with material participation. 

Although if it is worth hundreds of $Ms, it can just go public. The family interest would be diluted but the show will go on. 

That circles back to the question of "what is a family farm?"

RJG640v8
Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?


@sdholloway56 wrote:

A lot of farms keep the help busy off season hauling grain and I think most advisors will tell you to set up a separate corp. for the trucking on account of the huge potential liability.

On the question of an estate tax, if the estate is just a pile of stocks and bonds or passive property, no big deal- heirs would just have to sell some to cover tax liability and there's no economic impact.

The problem is with large, privately held firms. Again, if there is no material participation from the heirs and it has value then life will go on. The hard part is how to approach family owned businesses with material participation. 

Although if it is worth hundreds of $Ms, it can just go public. The family interest would be diluted but the show will go on. 

That circles back to the question of "what is a family farm?"


_________________________________________________________

if I was a crop/grain farm I would be separating out the spraying equipment and spraying operations..... that is an up and coming risk and liability concern to be sure. 

rsbs
Veteran Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

so you really don't wish to make those affected by your actions whole, either through insurance or liquidating your property?

interesting

Packard27
Senior Contributor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

In Emmanuel Saez’s The Triumph Of Injustice (2019), the author estimated that while Warren Buffett paid $6.9 million in taxes from a recent year, the amount itself represented <.1% of Buffett’s total net worth of nearly $80 billion.

Contrast that ratio with Joe Above Average who is living in a second quintile American household (i.e. 60-80%). He is a man who, along with his wife make $100K/year and have a net worth of around $100K, most of which is tied up in their primary residence. After deductions, Joe pays a total tax bill (i.e. state, local, federal, property, sales, gas, FICA, etc.) of around 15%.

This is not a case for a wealth tax. I am against it and also think it is probably unconstitutional. Nevertheless, it is an observation that the wealthy in this country do have certain advantages when it comes to protecting their own money. 

And so it goes...

 

RJG640v8
Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?


@rsbs wrote:

so you really don't wish to make those affected by your actions whole, either through insurance or liquidating your property?

interesting


____________________________________________________

they would be made whole to the letter of the law(s) through insurance , and or liquidation of said entity that was the root cause.  Summary judgement and settlement. Just as it should be. 

Like it or not the powers that be have come up with what everything is worth , eye, finger, arm, leg , life , equipment, vehicles, and pain and suffering as well as malice aforethought.  Bigger than that is that the entity takes steps to avoid such issues through excellent management and excellent operational procedures and planning.

Really shouldn't be that hard to understand...

Kurt#1
Senior Contributor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

It's long established that government, big business and ultra wealthy work hand in hand to thwart the average American from becoming rich.

Yes some sneak by but not to the level of billionaires.  

The incestuous relationship of the three I mentioned is evident in the regulations and laws that are passed.  The inability to pass on real wealth, the regulations that big business can pass the cost on but destroy small business are two examples.  Then there's the income tax, the property tax the sales tax that ensure you have just enough left to survive.  True some survive better than others but nowhere near the level of a Bill Gates.

It's said we're all in the same boat, well if you remember that stupid movie, "Titanic" you know that some on the boat were eating steak and some weren't eating much of anything.  There's a big difference between steerage and first class.

bruce MN
Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

Not sure how it plays out long term when, As has been becoming as trend, more and more wealthy individuals have openly addressed what you say. Wondering if they aren’t a bit embarrassed to be classified with certain others.

I’b surprised if The Buffets have tea with the Adelsons. Soros dinner with the Mercer’s. Cuban cocktails with the Koch’s.

But Mr. My Pillow does share riveting secret medicinal info with the Dennison’s.

sdholloway56
Senior Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

Not sure if Kurt was advocating for a wealth tax or what, about Buffett paying a lower rate than average Joe.

But either a wealth or estate tax is about getting at untaxed capital gains, ideally.

Probably isn’t anybody sitting on a clean, post tax billion.

rsbs
Veteran Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

retired and semi-retired guys that spend a lot of time in chat forums, opining about what should be done with the accumulated wealth of others are a special lot.

Personally, I have purchased my farms at auctions for the most part, paid more than anyone else would or could on that day, built them up with sweat and investments, and really don't see how it is any business of the progressives on who I transfer them to, or that the progressives should get a cut.

Those of you that have obviously worked harder and smarter than I do, maybe feel differently. There actually may be one such person in the USA, but I don't know the man or woman. The ones that I do know, the salt of the earth types that have worked hard, accumulated property seem to feel just the way I do.

 

r3020
Senior Advisor

Re: Wealth Tax, decade`s new buzzword?

When the man figures your wealth does ze include that $250,000 Camper?