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kraft-t
Senior Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

Tarrif on chinese imported tires are not taxes on americans citizens. You can choose to buy alternative choices. perhaps even american made.

 

!0% tax on tanning bed use will surely impoverish you! I'd march on washington if I were you.

kraft-t
Senior Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

Lord only knows you guys were so damned good at that!

dagwud
Senior Contributor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

"Obama has not raised anyones taxes as yet. NOT ANYONES!" 

 

Incorrect Don.  The 10% tax on tanning beds took effect July. 

 

CNN   "To help fund the $940 billion health care overhaul, a 10% tax on individuals receiving indoor tanning services was tacked on, and the initiative is expected to generate $2.7 billion over ten years."   "The tanning tax will go into effect July 1 and will apply to electronic products designed for tanning that use one or more ultraviolet lamps with wavelengths between 200 and 400 nanometers."

 

"Tarrif on chinese imported tires are not taxes on americans citizens. You can choose to buy alternative choices. perhaps even american made."

 

Some call it a tarrif while others seam comfortable calling a tax which is what it ends up being. 

 

definition of tax - A fee charged (\levied\) by a government on a product, income, or activity.

 

I suppose it depends on what is means?  Bottom line is a whole bunch of people making less $250,000 a year will opt for the less expensive Chinese made tires and will end paying up to $70 for a set of new tires.

 

CNN Money  So far Summers, who by all accounts was deeply involved in the President's decision to slap a 35% tax on Chinese tire imports, appears to be right: We'll call this episode a contained skirmish. 

 

Wall Street Journal  Since the tariff announcement on September 11, U.S. tire wholesalers have been warning that their sales prices to retailers will increase by about 15% on average. In some cases, the hikes are as high as 28%, according to industry sources. The only reason prices haven't risen by the full 35% tariff rate yet is that wholesalers still have some pre-tariff inventory stocks in their warehouses.  Eventually, this Obama tire tax will squeeze consumers hard because wholesalers and retailers have margins too thin to absorb much of the impact themselves.


Low-income Americans will bear the brunt of the pain because Chinese tiremakers sell the cheapest tires, retailing for about $50 a piece at the lowest. An extra $15 for two replacement tires or $30 for four—and up to $70 more once the full tariff cost hits the market—might not sound like much. 

 

tomtoolbag
Veteran Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

  It looks as though you want to try to split hairs on taxes, and play dumb as to what constitutes a tax. You know quite well he means INCOME taxes, and tanning bed taxes aren't mandatory, or across the board or even based upon income.

  So, what was it then when Bush threw that "tax" then on incoming steel???????? A tariff or a tax?????????

  I guess Bush really did screw us over more than we already knew.

Canuck_2
Veteran Advisor

Re: And to add Tom

Bush was also in power when the COOL legislation was enacted. Labeling laws that work like a tariff on Canadian (and others) products imported into your country. Another tariff is another tax.

dagwud
Senior Contributor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

We all remember Obama's famous promise about no tax increases which I have repeatedly said was not a smart thing to do as G.H. Bush can tell you.    "I can make a firm pledge.  Under my plan no family making less then $250,000 a year will see any form of  tax increases. Not your income tax.  Not your pay roll tax.  Not your capital gains taxes. Not any of your taxes."

 

Ollie first said, "does not seem as tho oblamos tax increases have helped a lot do you think-------NO NATION  can tax itself into prosperity"

 

To which Don replied, "Obama has not raised anyones taxes as yet. NOT ANYONES!"

 

Neither Don nor Ollie was specific in that they were refering to just income tax.   I assume they were refering to Obama promise which was about "any of your taxes."

 

The fact is the health care reform put a 10% tax on tanning.

 

The fact is the Obama administration imposed a 35% tarrif on Chinese made tires.

 

The fact is federal income taxes on cigarettes made its largest increase under Obama going from >39 cents per pack to $1.01 per pack.

 

Here are definitions I found for tax and tarrif with a Google search.

 

definition of tax - A fee charged (\levied\) by a government on a product, income, or activity.

 

tar·iff (tarif)

noun

  1. a list or system of taxes placed by a government upon exports or, esp., imports
  2. a tax of this kind, or its rate
  3. any list or scale of prices, charges, etc.
  4. Informal any bill, charge, fare, etc.

tariff - definition of tariff - A tax imposed on a product when it is imported into a country.

 

Please explain how I am splitting hairs?   Bottom line is Obama made a promise no presidential candidate should ever make and one you can bet his opposition will use against him especially at election time.  Obama was trying to win the vote of average Americans by promising he would not raise any of their taxes.  Most common sense non-political people will recognize a tarrif is a tax hidden under a different name but the result is the same.  The consumer ends up paying more for their tires and their tanning and their cigarettes.  This is yet another case where if the roles were reverse and the "No tax increase" was made by Bush then you would be seeing Dems complaining about the tire tarrif and the tanning and cigarette tax increases and rightfully so.

 

Yes I believe Bush's tarrif on imported steel also amounted to a tax.  It resulted in the government increasing the cost of particular product to the consumer.  By the way do you recall at the time **bleep** Gephardt criticized the Bush steel tarrif plan for not going far enough.  

r3020
Senior Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

All the steel tax did was make off shore production more attrative to companies that use a lot of steel. The trouble at the time was not the price of steel but the high value of the dollar. Couldn't hardly give a bushel of corn away.

tomtoolbag
Veteran Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

  I barely remember what you wrote because I was laughing so hard because you quoted Ollie. Between that and some convoluted theory that funding SCHIP with cigarette taxes, and somehow that's bad.

   I haven't paid ANY of those taxes, so yes, they didn't affect me. A tariff is by design used to shift preference to an inner source by pricing a foreign competitor out of competition. I could look it up in Black's Law Dictionary, but it's not worth the time for me because I really don't care. But buy all the Chinese tires you want, or don't. The pattern of toxic materials and substandard products coming from that country is the big reason I won't ever put them on any of my vehicles. I like my family and living too much to save a few bucks. Out of all the products coming into this country to throw a tariff on, that seems like as good of one as any, considering where it's made.

 

  Time and again, fees, "sin" taxes, or whatever you want to call them is always directed at the people on the bottom of the economic ladder. It's the Wal-Mart theory of finding a way to pay for things. The lower economic class usually doesn't vote, and the percentage of smokers is high, so guess what happens. Ironically the SCHIP is for the same group, so you should find some consolation in the fact they are funding it themselves through those types of taxes. Did you ever notice that taxes on beer will rise but not on top shelf whiskey??That same group because of personal habits and consumption patterns doesn't have any savings either. Paychecks and/or unemployment checks go out as quick as it comes in, that's why all the payday loan places are located in their neighborhoods. That move has been used by many politicians by both parties, and will be used again in the future.

kraft-t
Senior Advisor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

I guess then it is safe to say that the stimulus checks that came out to you me and every one else was a TAX CUT and I'll bet it was **bleep** site more than any tax increase you may have hadI

 

People are paying less tax under Obama. You could say thank you, Blondie!

dagwud
Senior Contributor

Re: When you taxes go up on January one 2011

Tom, I'm thinking your laughing may have been that nervous laugh people will sometimes do when they realize they don't get the joke or that the joke has been on them.  I generally don't read Ollie's new posts and don't respond to his threads because they are usually something one would hear off FOX or Rush.  However this thread was started by Don and Ollie made an accurate post while responding to a false claim made by Don who has yet to admit he was wrong.  Even now when confronted with the truth old Don tries to spin his way out of his lie by saying,

 

I guess then it is safe to say that the stimulus checks that came out to you me and every one else was a TAX CUT and I'll bet it was **bleep** site more than any tax increase you may have had

 

People are paying less tax under Obama. You could say thank you, Blondie!

 

Now Tom you too are trying to spin your way out of the fact that under Obama we have seen tax increases even though he promised us we would not see any on people making under $250,000.  Raising the federal tax on cigarettes 260% is definitely a tax increase on people making under $250,000 a year.   It does not matter what the money raised by the tax goes for it is still a tax increase no matter how bad you try to spin it.  I'm betting if Obama raised taxes on construction equipment 260% to help pay for handicap accessible housing for low income people you would be able to see clearly it is a tax increase.  It is getting harder and harder to carry on intelligent discussions on here when folks can not even bring themselves to admit the obvious. Yes many things in politics are convoluted and unsure such as.....  Will the stimulus money really help increase jobs and the economy?  Will interfering in other countries help or hurt us in the long run?  However I think it is pretty easy to tell if taxes went up on a product or if two idiots are speaking hated filled racist remarks that should be condemned as opposed to trying to make excuses for them. 

 

If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?   Looks like the new line should be,  If taxes are raised but Tom is not effected by any of the higher taxes is it still a tax increase?   James Carville and Karl Rove would be proud of you and Don.  If you guys are ever looking for a new career you could try political spin doctors.

 

I don't like to buy a lot of Chinese made stuff either all though I'm afraid we buy much more of it then we realize.  Good for you for choosing to not buy imported Chinese tires but the fact is millions of Americans with less disposable income then you are buying the less expensive Chinese made tires as a way to help save money.

 

I do agree with you on the sin taxes hitting people at the bottom of the economic ladder harder.  I have always been against Iowa and other states for getting into the lottery business as an easy way to increase state's revenues as I have always believed the shill game called lottery hits those at the bottom of the ladder hardest.  Seems a little evil to me to entice desperate people hoping to make a big score to better their lives into continually forking over money every week chasing a dream that in reality is one in a few million.