cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Contributor

Re: CRP Troubles

my thoughts based solely on nothing other than research i have done is, that if I dont sign and just start doing what I please on the land, ultimately they cant touch me, they would go after the older couple, which I wouldnt allow to happen, Id just like advice on whether or not your opinion is to wait on a potential farm bill that might eliminate the penalty or just pay up.

0 Kudos

Re: CRP Troubles

If you aren't willing to hang the old couple, or the church (or whoever is getting the CRP payments now) out to dry then you probably better just go sign the papers. But here's the thing. If I'm signing those papers, I'm getting the CRP payments. You shouldn't have to live up to the contract and not get the money. Those are my thoughts. As far as paying the penalty, I'd never do that. It is most often very cost prohibitive. One person mentioned grazing CRP. In most states you can do that from July 15-Sept 15 once every 3 years or a 3rd of the CRP every year (different thirds each year). You can also hay it under those same restrictions.

You have some of the ground not in CRP, if I understood you correctly. Could you fence it off and use it only? Might be enough for a cow or two.

Bottome line - sign the papers, start collecting your annual payment. At that point you own AND control the property and no one is effected but you.

Yes, there is a lot of discussion about early outs on CRP given our tight grain situation. My opinion is that is a long shot, but there is a chance. Wait and see.

Good luck!

0 Kudos
Veteran Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

Now that I have read through the thread I think I see where you are getting at:
You had a one-time shot to buy this land, and you took it, and are uncertain what to do about the CRP. 
If you make a stink, the penalty may fall on the elderly couple, which you don't want to happen.

 

Here is a thought.  Is there any wildlife on it?  Any birds, etc?

 

I know of one guy who hays his 1/3 or 1/4 or whatever is allowable.  He mows a 'strip', then leaves a strip 2 or 3 times as wide as his swather, then mows another narrow strip, leaves a wide one, and so on across the field.  After he gets his hay done, he has hunting in it.  The hunters get to walk down a 14 foot wide neatly cut strip, and their dogs flush birds out of the uncut strips.  I think he put stakes on the edge of the field as markers, so he has a reference where he mowed before, so he moves the cut strip to an unmown area the next year.  I don't know about the FSA rules for allowing hunting, or if you can charge hunters, or not.  If memory serves me right, he charges the hunters for 'meals, lodging, and guide services', which isn't all that much, plus 'tips' which can add up to quite a bit, if you are a good host.  The FSA office should know what is allowed.  I know I had some hunters pay $1 per acre per day, to hunt out here.  Doesn't seem like a lot, but if you get 2-3 groups out there, several times a year, it makes it worth while.  I also got a $250 'tip' from them.  They asked if they could come out next year, and I said, I suppose so, and one guy handed me 2 $100s, and a $50, and said 'thanks, see you next year'.  If you are the outgoing type, you can even make new friends doing this.
This sort of thing would let you get at least some income off of it, and you could always grow veggies & sweet corn & whatever on the other 9 acres, until the lease is up.

0 Kudos
Honored Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

It sounds lie you are describing the CP-33,which is a quail habitat program, and I believe it falls under the CRP. I have a 25- acre farm in quail jnVA, and 1/3 of it has to be mowed each year,a different thrd each year. The guy that gets the hay off the rest of the field area does the mowng, and the four guys who lease the hunting rights have assured me that it will get done by them,if be wvwr fails. The mowing has to be done outside nesting season, which I seem to recall is Apeil 15- October 15 in our region. Nstead of making plantings of prescribed forages,we let aural regrowth take place. The land was extremely fertile, so the weeds grew over a man's head the first year. I have skimmed this thread, and this situation is basically a mess. It is huge mistake to spend money you do not have, especially on a hobby. Items to agree with wnoeveraskeda out using the remainder of the land for grazing and gardens. Kids that age will not need ten acres to get quite enough experience with the outdoors and animals. Given roughly seven acres in the balance, you have enough to start with smaller livestock, and work your way up to cows. There are tons of books on small livestock management and garden production..." Five Acres and Independence" is a classic, " Barnyard in My Backyard" a more modern take. I probably have 20-30 titles in this genre', and none of them is a very expensive book to buy. The reason I say start on the acres that aren't encumbered is this: It is the first mistake of most greenhorns to go too big to start with...it is much easier to scale up than scale back, after too much money is spent. This land isn't tied into the program, so your use of it is less encumbered, too (unless it is wetland). If you are lucky, your CRP payments will at least cover your property taxes. Be VERY careful about leasing for hunting, unless they prove you are covered under at least $1 million in liability coverage.as a lessor. Your dream of having cattle will mean a lot of cash for stout fences, water supply, some shelter for their protection from extremes of the elements, and maybe expensive seeding and fertilizing of grazing areas. Can you do all of that,buy the animals, and pay tue $8K, too? If not, yo have answered your own question...you will have to wait and see. Lots more thoughts, but will stop here for now....
0 Kudos
Veteran Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

Yes, I forgot to mention the liability for hunting.  It cost me right at $300 for an annual $2 million liability policy.  You may also want to look into an LLC, so that if something does go horrifically wrong, all they can take is the parcel of land they hunted on, and can't go after your personal property.

0 Kudos
Highlighted
Contributor

Re: CRP Troubles

If you aren't going to just do what you want with the ground because it might cause the old couple problems then you might as well go in and get the paperwork in order so you at least get the payments coming to you.  After all it sounds like you are going to be following the program if you get the payments or not.   I'm not familiar with the CRP regs but if it's required to be mowed or something and you don't do it then the old couple could be in trouble too.  Seems to me you are more or less forced into following the program, so you might as well get paid a little something for YOUR ground not somebody else.  At least go in and check everything out and find out the details, they can't force you to sign.   A new farm bill might be delayed but I wouldn't be surprised if at some point they start letting people get out of contracts so they say they are cutting payments.  Just don't expect to be able to get back  in.  

0 Kudos
Honored Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

Our family has experienced one fatality on its owned farmland from a hunting accident, and the extended in-laws were involved in another. 

 

People think "It can't happen...we are careful,  experienced hunters," or "It's just a couple of our friends going after spring gobbler."  One lady we know is still living in her house today, only because her now-deceased husband killed his best friend on land that was leased by their insured hunting club. 

 

It is bad enough to be guilty of such bad judgment.  It would be far worse to lose your home and livelihood, for lack of paying a small annual insuracne premium.  Factor it into the lease fee. 

0 Kudos
Veteran Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

I looked at my policy, just got it in the mail last week so it was easy to find, and I had always carried a $1 million liability anyway, and adding the hunting liability, and bumping it up to $2 million only cost $150 extra.  I think if you own land, you need pretty much a $1 million minimum anyway, $2 million would be better.

0 Kudos
Honored Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

We carry $2 million in NC, and another $2 million in VA, figuring that covered the value of our assets in each one.  The mining company doing research on my homeplace carries $5 million, with me as an additional insured. 

 

Probably need to look at upping your limit, if your land values have greatly increased recently.  I should probably bump the coverage here this year. 

0 Kudos
Veteran Advisor

Re: CRP Troubles

I don't have that much, I'm still paying on my first 240 acres, and over half of that is grassland, not farmable.

0 Kudos