LP supply and prices

[belarus]

We pay eight cents on our single phase bills. 4.8 cents plus demand on three phase. Our electric co-op buys its power from the local power utility. The power utility charges about 13 cents for its customers.

[Shaggy98]

Good questions Belarus, that's why I said I would need to do some additional homework.

[Kay/NC]

Radiant flooring will givevyou a wsrm floor. We were stuck with forced air and ductwork...not very good ones at that.

[Kay/NC]

The thing about electric rates, too, is they go to utilities commissions or other regulatory oversight, when increases are anticipated. You at least have months to prepare, and even with fuel adjustments in the bottom line, they do not spike unpredictably, like LP has done this past month.

It seems to me that electricity only goes up so much at once, since it is an " everybody has to pay", politically loaded issue. The no -shortage thing is important...the grid is overbuilt in many areas now, given the stagnant development situation. There are peak shavings and other conservation offers that can help mitigate price, too.

[belarus]

Be careful and plan ahead if you are using geothermal for a radiant heat application. They are not efficient with "hot" water. You lose COP (coefficient of performance) fast as your delta or temp difference from load to source increases. Practically speaking you want enough half inch loops in concrete to run 80 degree water. And you are limited to 60,000 btu if you have single phase power. Math is pretty straight forward. Id be happy to go over it with anyone. Like I said though, be careful, cause geo radiant requires more planning ahead to control water temp required or you'll end up with a very inefficient system. Unlike wood or gas which can just crank floor water temp up with virtually no regards for efficiency loss.

[belarus]

Kay, I think we have massive natural gas supplies in US. I just signed up for a capped prices of 56 cents a therm. (Slightly more btu's than a gallon of propane).
We put in a new walk in cooler that would meet LEED platinum with non-demand cooling, super insulated box in box technology, led lighting, recycled material, fly ash in concrete on top cap, and water reclamation through a constructed wetland for drains. We are on 4.8 cent electric at non-demand times. Our high COP geo and refrigeration really makes sense on non-demand electric. Onset makes some really cool devices that make management non peak loads doable.
Geothermal really makes sense to replace propane. It's a lot fuzzier math to replace natural especially if the geo system isn't properly designed before constructed. I've seen some that this dumb farmer questioned how someone could sleep at night selling geothermal.

[Jim Meade / Iowa City]

While I had enough gas to make it through the winter this year, what got my attention is some suppliers revoking contracts because they can't get product.  It doesn't do any good to buy ahead if they won't be able to deliver.

So, I bought a 1,000 gallon LP tank which I will mount on a running gear.  I'll use it to supply LP to my grain dryers in the fall and when the season is done and before winter sets in I'll be sure it's full of LP so I will essentially have enough twice over to make it through the winter.

[Kay/NC]

Great idea, Jm!

[nitefarm]

The only way we can legally transport propane tanks in ky. without special license, is if they are empty and the Fill valve has been removed.

[Jim Meade / Iowa City]

Interesting.  Mine is entirely on my farm, never on a public road.