Dicamba, a complete fiasco but will it solve the soybean carryout problem?

[rickgthf]

  50 million acres of Xtend beans planted this year?  That represents 50 million acres of potential herbicide drift problems.

  Somebody in trump's EPA really dropped the ball on that one.

  But more than that, the Bayer (Monsanto) executives who greenlighted that project obviously didn't think it through very well.  As far as corporate fiascos, it ranks right up there with Volkswagon's emissions cheat or Boeing's fatally flawed Max jets.

  I've been reviewing some twenty-year-old research on Dicamba drift from cornfields into soybeans, research done years before Xtend soybeans were ever developed and it's readily apparent that Dicamba, even in so-called "low volatility" formulations couldn't be made safe.  Essentially, the potential for volatility   &  damage lasts for days, even weeks.  And worst, this wasn't some surprise, some unexpected thing, the research was readily available, no secret to any half-way competent herbicide chemist or weed scientist.

  Xtend soybean is a business model based on the idea that you have the legal right to trespass & damage your neighbor's crops.  It ranks right up there with the cigarette makers producing a product that is dangerously harmful to their customers.

  Now, the question becomes if it is no longer legal to use these products who's liable for the damages when farmer uses them anyways?  

  And,  does this situation have the potential to reduce the national soybean yield & production enough to reduce the carryout next year?

[Hobbyfarmer]

What really is going on was 

an arrogant company that has been getting away with ruining other peoples lives and businesses with drift issues for years.

Round up tolerant crop pollen drift has ruined many small farmers. It was fancy lawyers by the droves that convinced judges to fine or put out of business many heirloom seed producers.

The round up thing has run it's course as a financial golden goose for them.

The problem this time for them is the "drift " thing is not limited to just one crop. It gets any broadleaf type plant. 

Their lawyers can't bulldoze this thing past the judges and jurors this time.

Their arrogance was complete.

When I raised the drift issue thing to company reps several years ago, their answer was you will have to buy our soybean seed. It will be your only choice and defense if you want to raise soybeans.

They hung their hat on the wrong hat rack.

Plenty of ways to raise soybeans without that headache.

May take a little more management, but good bean yields DO NOT REQUIRE DIACAMBA.

[BA Deere]

No where near all the xtend bean seed sold was intended to to be sprayed with xtend, some companies like I believe Kruger only had xtend bean seed.  Some farmers bought xtend seed only for protection from neighbor drift.

Some beans planted in midish April only had a few days left where diacamba could legally be applied anyway. There`s a good 3 weeks left where Flexstar can be applied.  I really don`t see what the big deal is. 

If Zidua Pro was down pre, then flexstar post, you`ll get through this year...then do what smart farmers do and plant Enlist beans next year  🙂 

[rickgthf]

"Some farmers only bought Xtend beans for protection", isn't that extortion?  Some business model.

  By the way, several state EPA's are saying they're going to make it legal to apply dicamba.  By doing so, aren't they assuming the legal liability for damages?

  I would think that if  I planted any serious amount of Xtend beans with the expectation of using dicamba for weed control, I would be seriously considering filing a lawsuit against Bayer (Monsanto) soon just to get my name near the top of the list.

  How much of that acres are narrow-row or solid-seeded?

[BA Deere]

Sounds like you`re laying the groundwork for another "Syngenta type" lawsuit, Rick  🙂   

EPA might issue a stay and those in the gray area of spraying xtendimax might be fine, however after June 3rd you`re halfway up ElCapitan without ropes.  The heck of it is Status is going on corn legally right now, maybe that smokes a tomato patch and vinyard a mile away and you just sprayed your beans in the "gray area" guess who`s gonna get a knock on the dooor or nasty letter from Dewy, Cheatum and Howe? 

There`s no one enforcing the California order on Xtend, in Iowa IDALs and Sec of Ag Mike Naig aren`t, but they aren`t going to pay your legal bills either in this gray area.   The thing is it`s nice 80°s good spraying, but 90°s are expected, you spray and all`s well but a temperature inversion occurs with the coming 90°s and picks up and dumps your spray on the winery a mile away and your insurance company says "new phone, who dis?". 

There isn`t many drilled beans around here like in the past, mostly 30" and more & more 20"s.

[unlgrad]

I didn't realize that Trump hired everyone in the EPA.  I thought it is only Heads of Departments he puts in and I am sure that many of the EPA employees have been there a long while.  Who in their right mind blames the President for every problem that comes up.  Give it a rest, the propaganda machine needs to take a break.  November is a few months away, you need a new hobby.  And not a hobby to pester Hobbyfarmer.

[sw363535]

while we could use several new "Hobby's" don't even try to replace the one we have occasionally.

But before we continue the brick throwing on this forum, at least act like you can think past the stupid hate the president nonsense.  He is probably the closest thing we have to an honest leader short of a supreme court justice.  He tells you what he believes to be the truth..... Maybe the first president of that level of respect for the voters since the early 60's.  So give it a break and show some respect if you want to receive any.    

If you can't keep on with the Mutt and Jeff routine.

[illinifarmer]

Our date for dicamba here is like June 20th.  So , I’m sure there’s a difference in location as well as alternative crop maturity.  Like a broken record how consistently this system just repeats history.  Is there a drift issue, for sure was there a side effect for round-up, for sure.  Nothing new here folks.   ,  .  Closest thing to an honest leader hilarious 😂 I’m crying.  Biggest embarrassment in American history and as a product of his own demise probably the last time ever.  Most people learn from mistakes every failure is a learning experience.

[dancy5680]

Volatility is not an issue. No cases of post application volatility have occurred.  Yeild response to off target movement is rare. In three years I have seen zero cases.  Dicamba on corn continues, along with the new dicamba product labeled this year for soybeans. Off target movement is reduced by over 90% if all application requirements are met.

All of this is well documented to the EPA. 

All products are subject to off target movement. Lots of herbicides cause yield loss on the labeled crop, but visual symptomology is not near as east to spot. The only reason this is a big deal is because everyone turns into a phd level agronomist when it comes to spotting dicamba symptoms. 

[dancy5680]

Temperature inversions only effect off target movement at application. There is no volatility. University research has failed to link temperature driven off target movement. 

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@BA Deere wrote:

Sounds like you`re laying the groundwork for another "Syngenta type" lawsuit, Rick  🙂   

EPA might issue a stay and those in the gray area of spraying xtendimax might be fine, however after June 3rd you`re halfway up ElCapitan without ropes.  The heck of it is Status is going on corn legally right now, maybe that smokes a tomato patch and vinyard a mile away and you just sprayed your beans in the "gray area" guess who`s gonna get a knock on the dooor or nasty letter from Dewy, Cheatum and Howe? 

There`s no one enforcing the California order on Xtend, in Iowa IDALs and Sec of Ag Mike Naig aren`t, but they aren`t going to pay your legal bills either in this gray area.   The thing is it`s nice 80°s good spraying, but 90°s are expected, you spray and all`s well but a temperature inversion occurs with the coming 90°s and picks up and dumps your spray on the winery a mile away and your insurance company says "new phone, who dis?". 

There isn`t many drilled beans around here like in the past, mostly 30" and more & more 20"s.

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