milk is............

[jrsiajdranch]

Just stepped in for lunch so I thought I would point out that Woden area is the center of the Universe LOL.

BUt I agree that there is no common sense in Gov. no one has railed more against the stupidity of Gov. intervention than me.  As to bringing our boys and girls home lets do it yesterday. 

As to the "big oil gets subsidies" argument I will answer the same way my mom used to......" if all your friends gonna jump off a bridge are going to also?"  The whole world get subsidized so why not start getting ourselves weaned off on our timetable instead of DC.'s?  The subsidy is gonna end this year no matter what. However the will to change the mandate isn't there.  I talked to Steve king at the State fair about this topic and as consitutuionally conservative as he is he will not vote to end the mandate. I told him it was hypocriticale of him to blast obamacare and not blast E.

[jrsiajdranch]

JR, if you don't know about these subsidies for dairy, maybe you should get signed up.  The big dairies in my area are some of the most prolific land buyers around.  Even when milk was 1/3 less than now, they were buying up land in my area.

http://farm.ewg.org/progdetail.php?fips=00000&progcode=dairy

Really? 

Corn Subsidies** in the United States totaled $77.1 billion from 1995-2010.

Dairy Program Subsidies in the United States totaled $4.9 billion from 1995-2010.

  It's the big grain guys here that are driving up the cost of rent and land prices so Right back at ya! 

 ROTFLMAO

[jrsiajdranch]

JR, if you don't know about these subsidies for dairy, maybe you should get signed up.  The big dairies in my area are some of the most prolific land buyers around.  Even when milk was 1/3 less than now, they were buying up land in my area.

http://farm.ewg.org/progdetail.php?fips=00000&progcode=dairy

[bronzebacks]

As to the "big oil gets subsidies" argument I will answer the same way my mom used to......" if all your friends gonna jump off a bridge are going to also?" 

Can't argue with stupid!!

I believe that you missed the whole premise of my post. Sometimes eventhough it is not perfect the overall good far outweighs the bad. Cost of iraq and afgan wars to this date is approximately 3.4 TRILLION dollars. You can't even find an accurate number of deaths(7,000??) and who knows the number of life changing injuries. I firmly believe that if a plan like mine was instituted we could get the remainder of our oil from non-enemy states and tell them they can keep their oil. The amount of subsidies given would be offset by the increase in tax revenue. Bottom line:: While not perfect, The overall good far outweighs the bad. We don't live in an idealogically perfect world, everything is not black or white, sometimes gray is the best alternative.

[67guy]

Yeah, but how much has been spent on corn subsidies since ethanol started to get traction? The big corn subsidies were LDPs and counter cyclical payments. You can take away my direct payment and the blender's credit anytime but I've a hunch you still won't be satisfied. The anti ethanol crowd never wants to acknowledge the DDGs that go back into the food chain either.

[wt510151]

It's not gonna to happen. How many ethanol only cars or trucks will have to be purchased in the midsection? Is the government going to fund and run that like Obamacare?

Commuters could use all electric cars on both coasts and midsection. However, that would reduce ethanol as well as oil consumption. Ethanol isn't the only alternative fuel to oil.

[DW11]

JR,

So, you do know about the dairy subsidies?  Big surprise. . . . So, you are just a big hypocrite and justifiy it based upon the fact that dairy gets less money from the government than corn farmers?   

Well, then you should love ethanol because ethanol gets a lot less money from the government than Big Oil.

[Canuck_2]

Dang you guys have me totally confused.

The posters in Agforum always claim the USA is all 'capitalist' no 'socialism' allowed!

[arnfarm735]

I've been wanting to ask this question on this site for a long time. This seems to be the perferct place tp please the anti-ag pmnt crowd. (As in livestock guys.)

I would be willing to give up all ag subsidies just to get away from spending so much time at the FSA office telling them all my acre numbers, financial infomation, what crops on what fields, etc., etc.. My belief has been for years that the main reason for ag pmnts is to control how we farm -- wet lands, highly  erodible ground, etc. If you don't follow their programs they will take away your subsidies. By the way, I thought it was just a stimulus package. Doesn't the government create (and "save") all jobs???

Also it gives a great way to cover up cost of food stamps, WIC, etc. in the "ag budget." A great trade off between congressmen -- you vote for my food subsidies and I will vote for your farm subsides.

Now, there is no reason I can't tell the FSA  to go pound sand right now.  But I do remember the years that the only net income we had was equal to or less than the government payment. Good old grain embargos. Thank you very much, Jimmy Carter. Wouldn't just not going to the Olympics have been enough.  We showed those old Ruskies!!!

What happens to all that $300 per bag seed corn and $700 per ton nH3 go when we are no longer above cost of production of corn? We have been there before and will be again. Just ask the dairy guys -- who never seem to make a profit.

So where are we without our government welfare payments??? Better off or down the tubes??

BTW, eastern Nebraska IS the center of the universe.

[jrsiajdranch]

Oh come now DW11 Hypocrite?  I wasn't meaning that we have nos usbsidies and it might be hypocritical to point out that ours my industry is smaller than your industries. And the subsidies thing is rather unique to each sector of AG the cow calf guy is probably the most pure of all of us.

Do you realize tho that our subsidies are a income based subsidy?  We don't get a check just because we own cows like grain guys do for owning/renting land?  No matter the price we do not get any subsidy unless the margins close down to a level that theyse pmts. kick in.

If you had the same system you would have recieved no gov. pmts the last 4 years for sure and maybe 5. 

Also did you know that this last spring when the Gov. subsidised income insureance ( much like ur crop insurance) was offered it ran out of money?  How would guys have screamed if you didn't get your crop insurance?  You didn't hear a lot of screaming from us about that now did you? 

ANd alot of our subsidies at least the main one of the last decade ends in Dec. the milc pmt. is gonna get changed oh it will still be avaiable but with very tight criteria and very few pounds per farm eligible.

And THese subsidies have done more to keep farm income low than they have ever done to keep income up.

[jrsiajdranch]

No way are you or me or anybody else better off with these subsidies.

1, You wouldn't have given guys like me an argument against E we would just realize that this is the market and get used to it!

2.  The risk of failing would keep many from doing the stupid things like paying 500 an acre rent for three years up front. Like just happened around the corner from me on a lot of acres.

3. The Hypocrisy of USDA would be called out and the good citizens of this country would be outraged at the welfare recipients instead of farmers.

BTW as A side note I am down to almost no gov. pmts. on my farms. and I am not enrolled in the dairy program anymore. I figure if you can't do it when it's tuff you cant do it when it's easy. ( I keep the farms enrolled cause there is some rented ground and the landlord wants me to leep it enrolled.  He gets the extra money anyways. Oh yea thats reason #4!)